I was about to do some work for GNOME Shell’s “Run Dialog” when Colin Walters raised an interesting question: «<walters> I’m sort of unsure actually whether it makes sense to have a run dialog; seems to overlap a lot with where we want to go with the overlay search» (clarification: overlay is the mode into which gnome-shell enters when you press the “Activities” button – see this screenshot to see how it looks).
So, reformulating his words to an actual question, what’s the point of having a “Run” dialog when applications can already be searched for and launched from the overlay screen? Removing this would avoid duplication and free the Alt+F2 keyboard combination so that it can be used to enter/exit overlay mode (the “super” key is already used for this, but some keyboards don’t have it). On the other hand, launching applications which have no menu entry, or calling an application with some special parameter, would have to be done from the terminal.
What do you think about this? Are we missing any use case? Could you live without the Run dialog (having gnome-shell’s awesome overlay mode)? Comment!
What about running commands as a super user? Can that currently be done with overlay?
gksu gedit /path/to/whatever
or
metacity –replace, for that matter.
Just the same concern as Nooone here, otherwise it’s OK I guess…
Just allow running commands from the search box…
RubenV: Yeah, that was my first thought, but how is the search box going to know whether you just want it to search or you want it to run the command?
I think I would like to have both the run dialog, and the gnome-shell… :D
Also, I hope they keep the gnome-shell thing optional… although it is very nice, I like the simplicity of how gnome is now… and would like to see that continue.
I use the Run dialog all the time. It accepts URLs, files, command line flags, arguments to commands, prefix commands like gksu and is a lot quicker to type stuff like ‘pid’ after pidgin has crashed for the 6th time in one day.
When you are doing support it is also a lot easier. You IM the exact thing they should copy and paste. No futzing around with point clicky stuff or selecting something from a list of search results.
RainCT: allow the user to click the magnifying glass to expose other actions that can be initiated from this entry. This also opens the shell up for some extra extensibility.
RainCT: $
I use the run dialogue all the time, as mentioned previously for editing config files, e.g. “gksudo gedit /etc/apt/sources.list” and occasionally “metacity –replace” and “compiz –replace”.
I think lots of people rely on the alt+F2 keyboard combination to run apps. Removing it would probably annoy those people. I for one use it quite a bit. Maybe people who want to free this keyboard combination should have the option to do so. I agree with RainCT in that it’s confusing whether the search box will run the command or search it.
Just make sure $however you implement it that there is still some way to enter shell commands like we currently use Alt-F2 for today. I don’t care what combination you use, if you combine it with this or some other tool. There are just a whole bunch of cases where people want to enter a raw terminal command.
yeah, the ability to run a command is crucial. just make the search box do a search on and run on or something similar.
thunderbird uses this concept to send a message using keyboard shortcuts instead of clicking send (except is send now, and is send later)
If the overlay thing could be more Gnome-Do’ish then it’d be cool. My use case for the Run Dialog is that I primarily use a laptop and using a mouse is hard on my wrists, etc. so I tend to use they keyboard where possible. The Run Dialog is better for me because I know what I want and it’s faster to type out the first few letters than hunting through the menu. I also have a number of things I run that aren’t in the menus so I’d miss that.
I see no reason why alt+F2 should do anything but open a “run command” dialog, as is expected. Guides on the internet refer to that functionality being present, so it would be a usability regression to replace it with anything else or remove it.
I’d personally prefer that the run dialogue remain in the Gnome shell. Its useful when I have to (or want to) quickly run a “killall aplay” or “gksudo gedit /etc/apt/sources.list”.
Hi all,
I use the ALT+F2 everytime I log in, to fire the gnome-terminal. Its the same combo for users coming from windows so why change it.
I don’t use search much so I’m biased against that removal.
There’s my 2 cents.
I use it to launch applications reliably when the panel and other parts of the interface stop working. So if this Shell hangs for whatever reason, can I still run xkill and restart it?
I am also for running commands from the search box, that way no functionality is lost
Perhaps the best approach is something like Deskbar-Applet – http://www.gnome.org/projects/deskbar-applet
Sorry, but you MUST leave a way to run custom commands without a terminal – the “metacity –replace” example is an excellent one, and one I use a lot.
The run dialog inside gnome is pretty much a piece of crap.
Check out KRunner from Kde 4.2 eventually and learn from it.
Hope things will improve regarding the “Run…” // alt + F2 command
“how is the search box going to know whether you just want it to search or you want it to run the command”
In gnome-do if you enter the command eg. e2fsck (chosen only because I know it’s not in my menu) it is recognized and the option to run it is provided. Your new shell could do the same thing I guess, although I would appreciate if the commands were searched when you start typing along with the menu entries etc. Currently in my version of gnome-do you have to type the full e2fsck.
Leave it as it is.
When are you folks going to learn that you need to STOP taking AWAY features? It’s really getting aggravating that we get used to something and then, for no good reason, you just decide to change it. I’m not interested in searching for an app when I KNOW EXACTLY WHAT COMMAND I want to run. ALT-F2 is FAST, CLEAN and EASY ON SCREEN REAL ESTATE.
On of the biggest problems with the Free and Open Source community is that they keep on deprecating features, or refusing to implement features, because a couple of yahoos think that NO ONE is interested in it. This even happens when time and again they get requests for a specific feature. (The Pidgin/Carrier Fork fiasco is a PERFECT example of this..)
Instead of concentrating on useless changes like this one, why don’t devs start working on ensuring that everything works on as much hardware as possible?
Please do it like the Mozilla-Guys and the Smart Location Bar: Increase functionality, but don’t take the old one. GTK is a synomym for an API-stable, innovative framework, so should Gnome as a desktop be.
I use the Run dialog pretty regularly, for two use cases:
– starting an app without going through the app menu with mouse (Alt+F2, type “epi”, and there you get epiphany)
– starting an app that is not in the menu (like xmag)
Apparently the first use case would be covered by the Search entry? So, about the second use case: I don’t really want to open a gnome-terminal just to run xmag or xterm or some command that’s in my ~/bin/ dir (like meld-old – meld without Git support) or xclock -update 1 -digital… If you find a better way to allow executing those commands without opening a terminal, I’m fine with such a change.
Also, it’s nice that currently I can use Alt+F2 under KDE and Gnome similarly. I think it would be useful if this still works in the new shell.
oliver: Yes, your first use case would be fine with the search box (see the screenshot to which I point in my post).
Let me give you an example of where the Run tool was essential. This just happened this week. My bro-in-law was reconfiguring his Myth box and adding a new drive. He needed a live cd to be able to boot in and copy files over. I had an old Ubuntu 7.04 Live CD in my laptop bag and he fired it up.
Here’s the problem:
He really had no access to a mouse. He was like “oh crap!” I told him to hit Alt+F2 and he was able to get to a terminal. He wanted multiple windows open, which is why he used X.
Keep the Run tool! I do use it from time to time, and in cases where I had no mouse but still wanted access to X, it’s so useful!
slayerboy: Yeah, the overlay should IMHO definitely be usable using only the keyboard. Is being able to launch applications without the mouse the only concern you have against the removal of the run dialog? (By the way, note that you can currently access the menu with Alt+F1).
(To anyone in particular):
But sometimes a change with no backwards compatibility is necessary, as it happened with KDE4 and with Python 3. It’s true that it is GNOME’s idea to do this change gradually (unlike KDE did, it doesn’t look like GNOME’s going to go and throw everything away at once), but this doesn’t mean that we have to limit ourselves to what we already have.
What would be the point of GNOME Shell if it was just redoing the same what we already have, with just a few more fancy graphics? The whole point behind it is to innovate and to try new concepts. They may be great, or they may utterly fail, but if we don’t even want to consider doing changes we will never find out.
I’m not saying all this to defend this particular idea of removing the “Run” dialogue as we know it, but because I want to ask y’all to be a bit more open-minded and carefully weight new proposals before rejecting them for “being different”. Perhaps at the end it will come out that this is a bad idea after all, but at least we will know why, and perhaps this will help us find new ideas on how to innovate the desktop.
I also want to thank you for your effusive feedback – keep those comments coming! :)
I like the Gnome Run… dialog so far. However, when I was using Vista I found it really useful to just hit the Windows key and then type in the command. I think it worked.
What _I_ personally could live with is having it go like this
1. Type ‘esoteric command -number 1’
2. Options in menu to Search for ‘esoteric command -number 1’ and Run ‘esoteric command -number 1’ with default setting on Run
3. Enter starts that program.
I personally use Alt +F2 a lot as well. I guess mostly from the simple fact is that has been what I’ve used all along. I don’t mind trying something new, but I would miss the functionality of using the Alt + F2 key.
Regards
Louis
If there is any use case for the Run dialog, the overlay should be able to handle it instead. Perhaps with a Run applet, or by making the search field multifunctional. I think it’s bad design to have multiple interfaces that do the same thing (start an application).
– the one who made the run dialog for gnome-shell :-)
shouldnt linux be all about customizability and power users? compizconfig settings manager has the right approach, for example.
why not make the whole thing modular and customizable:
– which key comb brings it up (alt-f2 or something else)?
– whats the default action (search vs. run)?
– which key comb overrides the default (eg. ctrl-enter)?
thats how your really move conceptually forward and stand out from windows, os x, et al.
A solution could be to always show an option in search result to run the query as a command. I think there is something similiar in Gnome-do.
NO! I need that simple/guaranteed to work run dialog, gnome-do/gnome-shell and everything else is just too unsafe for my comfort level
I NEED the ability to easily run commands on my system…
“On the other hand, launching applications which have no menu entry, or calling an application with some special parameter, would have to be done from the terminal.”
Isn’t the main point of the Run dialog to run programs that don’t have a menu entry? Replacing it with something that can run only programs that do have a menu entry would be kind of missing the point.
I don’t use the “Run Dialog” at all, since there is allways at least one terminal open on my desktop. So, I think, the best solution would be to embed the terminal into gnome-shell…